HHT and HH PDR - old vs. new Findings:

C

cbjr

Hammer Time Executive member
So after some mailing mishaps, @kneedeep (thanks for the help) supplied me with a 125HHT to compare PDRs with the 124hh I had on hand.

As some guessed, the an individual PDR band on the new has more volume vs the old(about 15%). As a total, the new with 2 PDR vs the old with 3, old has about 22% more than the new.

This still brings to question, why pressure out sooner?

While handling and measuring, a couple things jumped out. First, the boattail(BT) of the HHT has more surface area on the base and a lower angle from center line. This gives more area for powder gas to push against and less space to go around (possibly less dwell time at ignition). Secondly the distance from last full diameter at start of BT to nominal bore diameter(0.260) is about 4x longer on the HHT vs HH. Front shoulders/ogive(from nominal .260 to full diameter) on both are too close to measure a difference and are very near together(point to point).

Top is hh, bottom hht. Notice faint ring at black lines. Tried to line up high point at last PDR to show differences in length to nominal bore diameter of .260 and see boattail final diameter.
20240116_074722.jpg
 
cbjr,
I'm curious if you are finding any accuracy differences between the two?
I just got some HHTs but haven't yet shot them. I was going to go with the same load as with the 124 HH.
It's not maxed out so I think I'm OK but now I'm wondering.
 
Gday cbjr
Awesome work as usual

My mind goes straight to something else ( terminally ) on your findings but let’s not do that yet

So only thing I wonder is do all of the hht have the same 🤷‍♂️

Got to run but ticking on it
Cheers
 
@littlebighorn, I haven't loaded any 125HHT, hence the donation from kneedeep. Otherwise I would've already had some on hand. So no help here on that front.

@Farleg I'm sure they aren't all the same. Example: 80HHT. Don't know if there are any others in the entire lineup that are so close, but completely different pills as the 2 in the comparison. If there were, I'd think the percentages would kinda be similar as these 2. As far as terminally, you can always PM me and I can start "ticking" on it for now.
 
Thanks for taking the time to figure these up. It’s a great comparison. I certainly overlooked the amount of difference in the boat tails.

If you’re up for it, I have one more task for you to perform. I’ll send you a text tomorrow about the details.

Thanks again
Kneedeep
 
Gday cbjr

To add to your great info here’s a bit from this muppet I rolled the pills over a ink stamp to get a idea of those bands on the surface area ea covered & the hht compared to the hh , definitely has more from my eyes so depending on one’s rifling I think it will also depend how one pressures out on the hht or not 🤷‍♂️


Moving on
Now let’s get kneedeep involved to do his magic on his superimposing one pill over another & I especially made it difficult 🤫🤪as pills upside down so he gets used to how it is down under shortly 😜

8F91A59B-D6AC-4719-B3C7-B86EA385DFA0.jpeg

Just ticking terminally here on that pic but I’m sure kneedeep knows why the 375 is partly there the other he will have to go back to some of our earlier discussions to work out where & what I’m looking @ or for

Although after this comment of mine on wondering “if all the hht are the same” I have grave fears I’ve toppled over the edge for full on muppet 😱🫣

No wonder kneedeep laughed
yes I’m going to hear about this & I await the banter 😇

Cheers
 
Farleg said:
I rolled the pills over a ink stamp
Click to expand...
Gday Farleg

Sounds like you were doing a bit of finger painting. Did you analyze any ink blots?

Did someone finally go see a therapist?!?! It’s certainly understandable after your comments below.
Farleg said:
Although after this comment of mine on wondering “if all the hht are the same” I have grave fears I’ve toppled over the edge for full on muppet 😱🫣
Click to expand...

On a more serious note, is that red ink or Joe pink on those bands?

Maybe not so serious,
Kneedeep
 
Gday kneedeep did the upside pills throw you 😜🤣

Hopefully this helps

kneedeep said:
(Kneedeep) Gday Farleg
( fordy ) Gday kneedeep

( kneedeep) Sounds like you were doing a bit of finger painting. Did you analyze any ink blots?

( Fordy ) Yes I did & it’s pretty easy don’t put to much pressure on them as you get some distorted images

(Kneedeep) Did someone finally go see a therapist?!?! It’s certainly understandable after your comments below.
(Fordy ) does it show My therapist just got back from holidays

( kneedeep) On a more serious note, is that red ink or Joe pink on those bands?
( Fordy ) No comment as that would be telling on joe & I’d never do that


(Kneedeep) Maybe not so serious,
( Fordy ) Correct but factual though 🤪

( kneedeep signing off ) Kneedeep
( Fordy signing off ) Cheers
Click to expand...
 
Farleg said:
Gday cbjr

To add to your great info here’s a bit from this muppet I rolled the pills over a ink stamp to get a idea of those bands on the surface area ea covered & the hht compared to the hh , definitely has more from my eyes so depending on one’s rifling I think it will also depend how one pressures out on the hht or not 🤷‍♂️


Moving on
Now let’s get kneedeep involved to do his magic on his superimposing one pill over another & I especially made it difficult 🤫🤪as pills upside down so he gets used to how it is down under shortly 😜

View attachment 5160

Just ticking terminally here on that pic but I’m sure kneedeep knows why the 375 is partly there the other he will have to go back to some of our earlier discussions to work out where & what I’m looking @ or for

Although after this comment of mine on wondering “if all the hht are the same” I have grave fears I’ve toppled over the edge for full on muppet 😱🫣

No wonder kneedeep laughed
yes I’m going to hear about this & I await the banter 😇

Cheers
Click to expand...
Rolling the bullets over ink to see the contact surfaces...Fordy, I don't care what they say about you, I think you're a daggum genius!
 
Grind the suckers down to the hollow point base there's a little knot when you get that far turn them around backwards shoot them into two milk jugs of water with a reduced load and you should be able to recover the shanks. 5744 and 4198 would be a good choice.

Just sayin
 
A more simpler reason for me was the .277 160HHT is longer than the 156HH which when round is maxed out in magazine COAL capacity requires more bullet seated into case. Heavier longer bullet seated deeper will generate more pressure. Plus the PDR crimp location may require additional deeper seating to accommodate the crimp location. Again adding pressure.

Which is why I am BEGGING for a new .277 HHT with 1.56" length @ ~148-152gr? @Farleg jump in!😂
@Steve Davis 🙏🙏
 
Gday @Muddyboots
The pdr band is so important to not only us crimpers & chatted to Steve on a different subject first ( I’ll post a thread on that as it’s way cool & had myself in fits of laughter) then the topic of big game pills & something else I’ll leave alone as only thoughts @ this stage but for the straight wall fellas or big game pills I’m looking forward to this if they will do it

Moving on I don’t see any advantages in a 270 , 160 hht even if the bands were in the correct position & a chambering could push it fast enough it’s just going to be so hard to balance it where a little less it’s game on

There is a sweet spot in the length of pills weight of pills to how fast one can push it in their chambering which get that in a balanced pill & hey presto I don’t think that’s going to be easily beat & will tackle about any critter with ease

I look forward to that getting done then I’ll stop calling Steve’s pills $hit 🤣🤣

Cheers
 
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